Water Farm first try

[Clear Head C]

well I am finally going to try hydro and decided on the water farm, the 8 bucket set.
I picked up some cuttings a couple of weeks ago from a fellow ty'er, very good cuttings I might add, they survived 4 days in the fridge till I had time to do them and just about all of them rooted, so thanks so much to that member.
I set up the system on sunday with what I hope is a weak enough solution, it takes 25 gal to fill, the fist 5 gals I put in at 600 ppm at 5.5 ph, but thought that might be too much for just rooted clones so I put in the next 5 gals of just fresh water ph'd to 5.5, the rest of the buckets I put in at 400 ppm.
I am using bitonicare products, pure blend pro organic grow, liquid karma, sweet and cal mag, plus grozyme.

checking the res last night I found the ph had remained stable, but it had changed in each of the buckets to 6.4, I had to put in about 15 drops or so of ph up to bring it back down to 5.5, it took a bit of time on the first bucket to make sure I wasn't putting in to much, I had to do it a drop at a time and stir then wait, but found that it was consistant in all other buckets.
I am really hoping this works, cause right now I only have 5 other plants right now in soil, 20 gal pots which are going under 4 1k's, 3 sensi star and 2 freisland.
strians I am growing in buckets are, Deep purple, Jack the Ripper, Space Queen, Jilly Bean, Sensi Star, Freisland and a strain I only know right now as JC, will have to get the name from the other member and post later.

any help or advice on grow will be welcomed, I will make a report on this grow every few days

[Clear Head C]

oh, I also have air pump on a timer, it's on for half hour off for same most of the time, my timer only has 20 settings so half the time it's on for 45 min and off for 30, I am wondering if i could even up the time more, because the system stilll seems damp after being off for 30 min. at least at this stage of growth I might be able to get away with keeping the air pump off longer, but when it starts to take up more water, then I will have to check it out, anyone use these before, any tips on aip pump timing

[Kalidi]

Interesting seen a bunch of different peeps veiws on these. Be fun to watch this.
Pulling up a chair..;)

[Small Time]

Good luck with the hydro setup Clear Head C. I'll also be following along. Do you plan on posting any photo's?

Small Time

[hashimoto]

I used to leave an airstone with air pump on 24/7, more oxygen the better for your roots.
You have to keep the water temps just right also, I forget what the optimal temp is offhand, maybe some other waterfarmers can help with that?

[greenman]

pullin up a chair for this one> i've been growin for 20 plus years and never had the cajones to go hydro>> good luck and I'm hopin to learn from this one > GM

[PotheadSabby]

Hello! Congrats on your new grow system, best of luck and hope it all goes well. Are you and Ms. Clearhead coming over on Thursday or Friday? See ya soon :)

[somenewguy]

I used to leave an airstone with air pump on 24/7, more oxygen the better for your roots.
You have to keep the water temps just right also, I forget what the optimal temp is offhand, maybe some other waterfarmers can help with that?



could this be why most hydro systems gain PH all of the time?
PH is after all just a measurement of the power of hydrogen so wouldn't the more air introduced the more the PH will rise???
I was adjusting the PH of my waterfarm seeveral times a day till I wondered how much effect the massive amount of air bubbles i was introducing to the system.

[hashimoto]

could this be why most hydro systems gain PH all of the time?
PH is after all just a measurement of the power of hydrogen so wouldn't the more air introduced the more the PH will rise???
I was adjusting the PH of my waterfarm seeveral times a day till I wondered how much effect the massive amount of air bubbles i was introducing to the system.

Honestly it was hit and miss for me with the powergrower, I had one Dutch Passion Blueberry yield 125 grams, all the other plants didn't do near as well.
But to reply to your concern about the air bubbler on all the time adding to the ph level, I had many successful DWC closet grows, using a tiny 12 liter reservoir, changing basic a&b nutes weekly, with no ph rising problems. I don't think it's the air that adds to the ph, or I would have had problems with the small setup I was using in DWC, the air pump was always on.

[somenewguy]

Not sure where the PH issues root from but most everyone I know to use them has had some sort of PH issues. My PH rebound would happen in litterlly an hour after adjustment. Then I guess it could be me! lol

[Clear Head C]

I used to leave an airstone with air pump on 24/7, more oxygen the better for your roots.
You have to keep the water temps just right also, I forget what the optimal temp is offhand, maybe some other waterfarmers can help with that?

sounds like a very good tip, I have extra air pumps, used to be a fish tank nut.
should they be used now or should I wait until the roots make it to the water.
they have just been transplanted and have to grow about a foot to get down to the water level.

I checked the ph tonight and again it has risen to 6.4, this time it was much easier to ajust the ph, the main res doesn't seem to rise much, tonight after 3 days it has only went up to 5.8, so I droped it down to 5.0, I realize it's a bit low, but figure if the buckets rise a bit then maybe this will slow it down.
I will post some pic's in a few days
will be down on the week-end to see you guys potheadsabby and pete.

[Clear Head C]

Not sure where the PH issues root from but most everyone I know to use them has had some sort of PH issues. My PH rebound would happen in litterlly an hour after adjustment. Then I guess it could be me! lol

I am not sure either, but have heard people say they have had little ph problems, so it could be the nutes we are using.

[Clear Head C]

it looks like the ph rising is going to be a constant thing, at least for now. first week is passed will change water for the first time tomorrow, which will make it 9 days since I first started, there has not been much growth and one cutting died.
there is new growth on the rest, just not much for the first week, just scratching my head.

[PharmaPharmer]

I've only grown one plant in a hydrofarm but gained some good experience. First off my pH was totally unmanagable using PBP so I switched over to the GH/AN Flora series that came with the unit. Once I made the switch the plant took off and no more hardcore pH troubles. I experienced explosive growth. In fact it grew so fast and big that it was troublesome.

[Closet.Toker]

Maybe the friction of the air bubble is causing the air stone to slowly dissolved. The material used to make the air stone may be increasing the ph value. Or the material used by the plant to hold it in place.

[Clear Head C]

I've only grown one plant in a hydrofarm but gained some good experience. First off my pH was totally unmanagable using PBP so I switched over to the GH/AN Flora series that came with the unit. Once I made the switch the plant took off and no more hardcore pH troubles. I experienced explosive growth. In fact it grew so fast and big that it was troublesome.

I believe you are right on the money on this, not only is trying to do this organically causing ph issues, but a pain to clean the res each time as in the instructions and quite a film builds up inside.

I did the water change today the same as when I started, in the next few days I will do another change and go with the nutes that came with it.

[salmayo]

I tried organic nutes, in a bubble emitter bucket system and it not only had pH shift, but horrible goo build up clogging up the emitters.

I attributed this to microbe blooms feeding of the carbs in the mix and like wise the pH shift I assumed was from the bio consumption of both organic and inorganic acidic and basic ions at different rates.

Since I have been burning out the carbs using Oxygenated Plant Tea methods to compost/ferment out the carbs. This allowed me to filter out the slimy residue/film before adding the solution to the hydro reservoir, and once the carbs were gone and the solution had stabilized, not only did the filmy residue of slimy build up stop, but the solution is pH stable after the oxygenated composting, which allowed it to be pH adjusted and then remain stable once oxygenated and stabilized in the oxygenated (bubbled) form.

Since oxygenating an oxygen poor or CO2 rich solution can change a solutions pH, it's best to pre oxygenate any hydro mix and keep it oxygenated in the hydro units, in order to avoid pH shift either way (O2 lean to O2 rich, or O2 rich to O2 lean).

If you add carbohydrate rich organic nutes to your hydro unit, they will compost/ferment in your hydro unit with all the typical films foam and pH shifts. By pre composting the mix with Oxygenated Plant Tea methods, the nute mix has stabablized and any residue can be filterred out before contaminating your hydro system with it.

Good luck with that Water Farm. :)

[Clear Head C]

I tried organic nutes, in a bubble emitter bucket system and it not only had pH shift, but horrible goo build up clogging up the emitters.

I attributed this to microbe blooms feeding of the carbs in the mix and like wise the pH shift I assumed was from the bio consumption of both organic and inorganic acidic and basic ions at different rates.

Since I have been burning out the carbs using Oxygenated Plant Tea methods to compost/ferment out the carbs. This allowed me to filter out the slimy residue/film before adding the solution to the hydro reservoir, and once the carbs were gone and the solution had stabilized, not only did the filmy residue of slimy build up stop, but the solution is pH stable after the oxygenated composting, which allowed it to be pH adjusted and then remain stable once oxygenated and stabilized in the oxygenated (bubbled) form.

Since oxygenating an oxygen poor or CO2 rich solution can change a solutions pH, it's best to pre oxygenate any hydro mix and keep it oxygenated in the hydro units, in order to avoid pH shift either way (O2 lean to O2 rich, or O2 rich to O2 lean).

If you add carbohydrate rich organic nutes to your hydro unit, they will compost/ferment in your hydro unit with all the typical films foam and pH shifts. By pre composting the mix with Oxygenated Plant Tea methods, the nute mix has stabablized and any residue can be filterred out before contaminating your hydro system with it.

Good luck with that Water Farm. :)

just wondering how long you fermented your mix before using, I have a few 55 gal drums i could use to pre-mix my solution and airiate.

[salmayo]

The amount of time needed to complete composting/fermentation depends on temperature, and somewhat on the carb content, type and material condition. I haven't been able to find a reference that indicates this, but with at a temperature of 75F degree I let mine bubble for 3 days minimum and usually a week, from adding plant tea, about 1/4 cup molasses and dry brewers yeast to about 4 gallons water for Vegging mixes,but only about 1 tablespoon molasses for flowering mixes.

Repitching works faster, so leaving some in the bucket/barrel and adding new neutrients kicks it off faster and it usually takes less time than just starting over. If I use a gallon and just replace a gallon of fresh nutes, it only takes a day or 2 at 75F.

Lower temps take longer, and if you go below about 45 degrees it seems to halt altogether.

Other than adjusting pH if needed, I use the Oxygenated Plant Tea mainly as a foliar spray.

I do mine indoors with a Blow Off Bucket with Hydroden Peroxide and exhaust tube to my grow area, it kills the smell and take advantage of the extra CO2 produced. With out the Peroxide, the smell will attract bugs, especially if you are using any carbs as sugars in the mix. Operating the fermentor/composter indoors makes it easier to keep the temps up this time of year.

[Clear Head C]

I am holding off changing the nutes this time, first change was about 9 days and it has been that since last change, so should do it now, but have to go to doc's tomorrow in toronto, so it looks like it won't be done till friday, which will make it 11 days.
things are looking ok, the ph has sort of stablized, if 6.4 is ok, half the plants seem to have taken off. while a few others seem to be taking there time ajusting, they are alive with new grow, but not much to speak of.

I missed ajusting the ph one day and found that this time it did not rise above 7 but stayed down around the low 6's
I also checked the ppm's in each bucket after nutes have been there a week the ppm is still at 600

[Clear Head C]

so today I changed the nutes to general hydroponic's to try using a cleaner solution, it's a pain to clean the pails each watering, so decided to make the change.
I used
40 ml of both micro and grow
20 ml liquid karma
30 ml sweet
30 ml grozyme

I had tried the recommended volume of micro and grow, which was about 70 ml each for a 5 gal bucket, but it ended up at 2200 ppm, so I mixed in another 5 gal of water by pouring half into another bucket, I then added the other stuff and it all comes out at 1200 ppm, I will try this to start and watch how it affects the plants

[Pothead Pete]

If I was you I would also add a little of the Floralicious grow for the first week or two just to give that extra little jump start then back off on the grow. Anyways God Bless and keep us posted!!!:cool: :cool:

[Clear Head C]

I am almost at 4 weeks since starting and one week since I changed the nutes, half the plants are doing well or so I think, not sure have not seen this done before and they have passed the ones I have in hempy buckets.
I will post some pic's this week end once I get around to downloading from my camera.
one thing that is strange, since I changed to chemical ferts I have more slime growth in the res, bunch of black fuzzy stuff, stinks a bit as well.

[Clear Head C]

here are some pic's of the plants I have in the waterfarm, there are also some pic's of a new system I am trying called hempy buckets, they seem very easy to do
the water farm has taken off since I change to the recomended nutes, even the little deep purple is showing signs of wanting to go
not sure why the dates on pic's are screwed, just took pic's tonight

[Clear Head C]

the hempy buckets are doing very well since I have put them in 3 gal containers, the pic's above are only 2 days after transplanting, before that they were in plastic cups for way to long and were a little root bound, so today I am off to buy a few more buckets to do my last 5 plants which I was planing on doing in soil if the hempy buckets didn't work. the only thing now is I will have to change to flower a lot sooner than I had expected, cause these babies are going to get toooo big if I don't do it soon

[salmayo]

I am almost at 4 weeks since starting and one week since I changed the nutes, half the plants are doing well or so I think, not sure have not seen this done before and they have passed the ones I have in hempy buckets.
I will post some pic's this week end once I get around to downloading from my camera.
one thing that is strange, since I changed to chemical ferts I have more slime growth in the res, bunch of black fuzzy stuff, stinks a bit as well.
The slime and black fuzzy stuff and stink are probably caused by the carbs in the Sweet, resulting in bacterial and fungal/mold growth/spoilage in the solution.

This is what I avoid by bubbling Oxygenated Plant Tea type mixes to get rid of the carbs to stabilize it and then filter out or "rack" off goo or solids, before they can cause problems or simply messes and smells in my indoor garden.

I mainly use this for making bio boosting foliar sprays and don't really like having them sitting arround in pots or hydro, and they seem to really attract bugs and inspire algae more than without them.

But if you like the results in your buds and think it's worth dealing with, then I can see using them whichever way you want.

[Clear Head C]

these are some more pic's taken today after changing the nutes, I am hoping to put into flower soon as I am afraid of the monsters that may hide in here if I don't

[Clear Head C]

lets try this again

[Pothead Pete]

from one week ago......those plants look twice as big as they did a week ago so....unless you live in an airport hangar you better start flowering those lovely ladies as they will be MASSIVE if you keep on vegging much longer!!!he he.....:D :D

[Clear Head C]

I just changed the nutes and have the flower room set up with 4 1ks in cool tubes, air from outside to cool tubes then back outside, I also have co2 set up, but still need to grab a 4" exhaust fan to keep hummidity down, here are some more pic's of the little ladies

[green girl]

They look nice, but small. Very small!

Please, please go a bit bigger. I go with 700x700 max pixels, and I compress the jpg to about level 5 a medium level. This makes the files between 50-90kb using a 12mp camera. I already going blind and using the whole "ctrl +" and "ctrl -" to play with the font, but pictures don't rescale. Pleeeease.

Looks like a very neat project. I haven't been following so closely. But I'll go back and look at the timeline!

[slater]

you are going to have some monsters on yer hands...

[Hammer]

nice... :)

[pierre drouin]

your garden looks good my friend.

keep them up and growing:)

should have nice huge buds at the end :D

[green girl]

Urk, ook ugh. Well I tried! :D But my eyes glazed over the more I read ph balance... I still have some old fish tank equipment if you can use it. I wonder what a fluvial pump would do for the system? Not that I want to try myself!

Your plants look very nice. Awesome to see both sativa and indica looks in the mix. And also amazing how fast the plants grow with a hydro system.

[Clear Head C]

another water change today, everything is going fine, had one problem with the deep purple, it's a tiny one, i knocked it over while trying to fix a timer, but it will live although it has some bad burnt leaves due to having water from the bucket on the plant.

[Nardwarz]

Loooooking goood mang. :)

[Clear Head C]

second week of flower nutes are given as follows
2 tsp big bud
50 ml floramicro
37 ml florabloom
13 ml floragrow
25 ml growzyme
2 cap fulls of 20% phosphoric acid

after a day in this solution they all seem to be very happy, hempy buckets are also doing well on same solution, only one seems to be showing any signs of stress, it's a bit stranges cause it's one of the romulans and they usually take to heavier nutes just fine

[Clear Head C]

I think I have the nutes right now with some help from a friend, per 5 gal bucket, takeks 4 buckets to fill system
1.5 tsp of big bud
45 ml of flora bloom
30 ml of flora micro
15 ml of flora grow
2 cap fulls of 20% phosporic acid
80 ml of sensizyme

things have been growing sooo dam fast, the only problem I am having now is trying to sex a romulan, not really sure about it. could be a sly male trying to sneak in, anyone with more sexing experiance, would you mind taking a look at the romulan, it's now 15 days in flower and sneaky, I figure male and should just pull the bugger, any suggestions?

[pierre drouin]

it looks like a male bro.on the one picture you can clearly see that it's a set of balls.watch it for the next 2 days you'll see alot more come out if it is a male:rolleyes:

nice looking garden man keep up the good work:)

[Mamahawk6]

lol when's harvest! Great to see C!

[Binky]

Its hard to tell from the photoif its a male or female:confused: But if you suspect male! keep it close to the door:D You might have one day's grace before those lil' balls burst and ruin a crop:eek:

Otherwise, its a big change for you and you'll learn by your mistakes, seems to be doing good so-far.

Have you started to flower them yet?

[green girl]

Looking seriously dense and heathy, nice job so far! Hope your question plant is a female! :p

[Clear Head C]

well when the light came on tonight I found the romulan downstairs that was looking exactly like the one upstairs had started to bud, so she's a girl,
clear head c is now handing out cigars

[Clear Head C]

end of week 3, start of week 4, have changed from big bud to kool bloom, here's the nutes I gave it today per 5 gal bucket, took 4.5 buckets to fill system

30 ml floromicro
45 ml florobloom
15 ml florogrow
40 ml kool bloom
40 ml growzyme
2 cap fulls of 20 % phosphic acid
the solution is between 1200 to 1400 ppms, flashes between, so should be about 1300
the ph is about 5.6 to 5.8 depending on the bucket, average about 5.7
having trouble taking a pic of just one plant, they are growing together too much, will not veg quite this long again, plants are getting out of hand

[Clear Head C]

had a bit of a close call with the plants, the float value system in the res got pluged, I was starting to wonder why the plants were not taking water the way they normally do, top res was not dropping fast enough as far as I was concerned. I lifted one of the plants out of the bucket to check water level and found only a half inch of water, I filled bottom res by hand then sought out the problem, once I seen how it was clogged, almost a sugary substance, I got a garden hose and put it to the clogged value and got it back at me, oh ya make sure it's open so that don't happen, other than that it's going great, I am down to 4 hempy buckets in the water farm room, down from the original 13 hempy buckets and the 8 bucket water farm. I moved the other plants downstairs where there was more room and light, the water farm buckets have over shadowed the hempy buckets leaving them with little light.

[neutrino99]

..with water has gone so well.

I really prefer it - though I dont have as nice a set up as you.

Everything looks so lovely - dunno how I missed my cigar! :)

You and Tammy thinking about coming on the tubing trip March 9 from 11-6?

(I'm likely not tubing...just taking pics....I think its beyond my disability and dont think I could dress warmly enough but it will be fun none the less!)

[Clear Head C]

just changed the nutes again and things seem to be going well, had a mishap yesterday, one of the cool tubes fell, it didn't go real far, but did touch the plants, no damage was done because it was caught right away, I had used one of those plastic retainers, the ones you put one end through and eyelet and tighten, instead of a s hook, which I didn't have, now it is wired up and the other one like it has a safety chain now.

sorry neutrino99, but we won't be able to make the tubing run in march, my car broke down on friday and it is still at the machanic's, looks like I will be without a car for a while.

[kenbev40]

well I am finally going to try hydro and decided on the water farm, the 8 bucket set.
I picked up some cuttings a couple of weeks ago from a fellow ty'er, very good cuttings I might add, they survived 4 days in the fridge till I had time to do them and just about all of them rooted, so thanks so much to that member.
I set up the system on sunday with what I hope is a weak enough solution, it takes 25 gal to fill, the fist 5 gals I put in at 600 ppm at 5.5 ph, but thought that might be too much for just rooted clones so I put in the next 5 gals of just fresh water ph'd to 5.5, the rest of the buckets I put in at 400 ppm.
I am using bitonicare products, pure blend pro organic grow, liquid karma, sweet and cal mag, plus grozyme.

checking the res last night I found the ph had remained stable, but it had changed in each of the buckets to 6.4, I had to put in about 15 drops or so of ph up to bring it back down to 5.5, it took a bit of time on the first bucket to make sure I wasn't putting in to much, I had to do it a drop at a time and stir then wait, but found that it was consistant in all other buckets.
I am really hoping this works, cause right now I only have 5 other plants right now in soil, 20 gal pots which are going under 4 1k's, 3 sensi star and 2 freisland.
strians I am growing in buckets are, Deep purple, Jack the Ripper, Space Queen, Jilly Bean, Sensi Star, Freisland and a strain I only know right now as JC, will have to get the name from the other member and post later.

any help or advice on grow will be welcomed, I will make a report on this grow every few days I've been using this very system for some years now. Make sure to clean the stem were the airline concess to the system. It will have a build up right at this point and you'll need to check it at the point weekly. If you don't the build up will stop up the line which will stop the stem from drawing the water up it. Clean the pot and stem between grows with soap and water. Use WD40 on the airpump to keep it working happly along. With the airpump run each airline split between two plant it keeps you from having overwatering problem. By reduse the flow just enough to keep the plant fat and happy. You have the 8 pot system right ? With it all hooked up leave one empty bucket clear of rocks hook to air and the water just driping down this add o2 to the water which help keep the roots health. I use a pump to drain the whole system hooked up shut off valve http://www.bghydro.com/BGH/itemdesc.asp?ic=HPMIV12&eq=&Tp= you can also use a wet/dry vac to completely drain the system.
This is a good system for most plants except the pure sativa that want to be as tall as an xmas tree. You can grow them you just have to top them to keep them from getting to big.
Please let me know if I can help you a may not know everything but I know were to look and more then have the time.

[Clear Head C]

I've been using this very system for some years now. Make sure to clean the stem were the airline concess to the system. It will have a build up right at this point and you'll need to check it at the point weekly. If you don't the build up will stop up the line which will stop the stem from drawing the water up it. Clean the pot and stem between grows with soap and water.

thanks for your reply and it sure is welcomed and I would be thankfull for anymore tips you could give me.
I have not emptied each individual bucket for some time now, I have been draining the system out of the bottom res through a hole in the floor down to a drain in the basement, but have been rinsing the stones at each water change and cleaning the emitters, can I clean the stem by just raising the drip emitter and pulling it out or could I spray water down it from the top under pressure. a few of the plants I could still lift out of the bucket to clean the other way, but they have gotten real big, no way to do the freisland that way unless I cut some off,

[Clear Head C]

another water change today and I also tried to flush out the air lines, the ones I could take out were almost clogged, so it was done just in time, thanks kenbev.
I still am having problems with the float valve clogging, but as long as you check it every couple of days it's ok, you notice when it's clogged when the water in the top res is not dropping.
keeping my fingers crossed that nothing else goes wrong in the next few weeks, here's a few pic's of some plants that I can still get a shot of, most of them have grown together so much it's hard to tell where one starts and the other finishes

[sevens]

are they all finish at the same times or ..you have plants who will finish at different times look there is a difference in their stage of maturity ...they just look so nice at the beginning i did think you should have wait one more week for veg ...i see now you where right .very nice ..i can smell them ..lol...:)

[benwire]

Lookin good C. good luck with the hydro.:)

[Clear Head C]

are they all finish at the same times or ..you have plants who will finish at different times look there is a difference in their stage of maturity ...they just look so nice at the beginning i did think you should have wait one more week for veg ...i see now you where right .very nice ..i can smell them ..lol...:)

the freisland, sensi star, jack the ripper and jacks cleaner2 are all suppose to be around 56 days or so.
I am not sure about the space queen or jilly bean yet and my deep purple didn't seem to go this time, some clones just seem to do that, but the other strains in the room are posh, babilonian, romulan and sweet tooth most of which are also around 8 weeks but are in hempy buckets so can go longer if needed without causing much fuss,
my main problem this time was vegging a bit to long, plants make it hard to keep the air line clean, well the ones I could check were almost blocked and the other were to big to be able to lift out without causing big problems with other plants, so I sprayed a jet of water down them to hopefully clear the line when I was draining last weeks nutes, I'll have to find something that will fit down the air hose at least till this grow is done.

[Clear Head C]

flush day, just started to flush, here are some pics of the bud so far

[green girl]

Looking very nice CHC. Can't wait to see these thicker!