Is It Worth a Try????

[Roy]

I am planning on using some "duff" (duff, for those who don't know is what is left over after using a Volcano Vapourizer) to make some cookies.

I am aware that one of the main problems, with cooking with marijuana, is the taste of the marijuana in the food. To that end I have just started a water cure with about 2 ounces of duff. I'm only on my second day, of a seven day cure, and the water looks very dark. I think that this is a good thing but I could be wrong.

I'll let you folks know how things work out but in the mean time could you give me some incite into "what do you think"?

I'm just goofing around but I'm having fun!

[pflover]

if you have never cooked with duff i suggest you try some without water curing it as i personally thing that duff that is not too dark produces some of the best tasting cannabis food ever. roasted cannabis... yummmmmmmm!

that said, if the duff is particularly dark (slight on the burn side) then water curing could remove any of the burt taste which is actually quite unpleasent.

my duff tends to be on the tan to light brown side but some people use a higher temp for the final vap and get a dark brown duff. the darker the duff the more a water cure might be beneficial.

[Roy]

Thanks PF for the info.

Maybe I vape at too high a temperature as the water in the jar this morning is still very dark. I will change it and check it tomorrow.

I'm finding the process very interesting.

[sedative ocean]

Just a little tip that I employ when I cook with duff.
I mix the duff with the butter making sure the duff is well buttered.
I then add it to the recipe.
My logic in thinking this is the duff is totally getting exposed to the butter thus better extraction of the tch from the plant matter.
Seems to make a difference.
I also cook long and low, at 200 degrees Celsius. You pretty much have to watch what you are cooking, and check it regularly. Most things take about and hour to hour and a half to cook at that temp.
Some spices can be added that can contribute to having a better high, and help mask the flavor. Cinnamon, Ginger are a few that come to mind.
Duff has a kind of nutty taste.
Enjoy and have fun and let us know how it went.....

peace
Donna

[onus]

Having eaten baked goods both with and without actual duff or virgin shake or the like, I recommend that you try making cannabutter. It's certainly no more trouble than a water cure (more cleanup maybe), and there is no comparison re: taste or texture. There are plenty of recipes around. I've tried it both with and without the water, and both work well although the straight butter version seems to taste slightly better to me.

Once I tried cannabutter and became convinced that the process extracts the cannabinoids quite effectively I've not looked back. I don't know but maybe someone is following me.

onus

[pflover]

Roy it is the color of the duff that matters most, i bet only lightly colored duff would still produce a very dark water. could be wrong. if you ever compare let use know.

[pflover]

as SO points out. ginger, cinimon and black peper increase absorption.

[pflover]

onus, have you ever tried cannabutter made just from duff (pre-vaped buds) and nothing else? i personally find that it is both better tasting (rosted cannabis!) and surprisingly potent.

[pflover]

onus, have you ever tried cannabutter made just from duff (pre-vaped buds) and nothing else? i personally find that it is both better tasting (rosted cannabis!) and surprisingly potent.

[onus]

pflover:

No, I have to admit, I've never tried extracting butter (or eating as-is baked into cookies, etc.) post-vap herb. I own an Inavap, surely no Volcano but a very useful device, and I have saved a bit of the used herb thinking I would try it. Seems like when it comes time to actually make it, I just use leaf and very-bottom buds. I should try it. I like things with a smoky taste--Texas Barbecue, scotch, smoked salmon, even overdone popcorn.

I hope that the next time I cook up a batch I'll think of your recommendation and not get lazy. That laziness has also kept me from trying to use the straight butter version of cannabutter (no water used in the extraction) with a light oil such as hempseed instead of butter. I have diabetic neuropathy which produces burning, tingling sensations in the skin on my feet and I have often wondered if a topical application (something like a moisturizing oil but with extracted cannabinoids a la cannabutter) would relieve some of that.

Thanks for the suggestion. Re: surprisingly potent, it would be very interesting to try it since I perceive the vaporized high as different from the smoke high. Maybe what's left in the raw material would create a different-feeling high. Interesting.

Thanks again.

onus

[pflover]

overdone popcorn! lol that is very much part of the taste.

i also find the vapor high to be rather different than the smoking high.

do you know anything about the root? i personally would not suggest eatting it as i have read refferences to it being poisonus when taken internally. that said it makes an interesting topical pain reliever. i really need to get my ass in gear and make some up. should start a batch next weekend.

[Roy]

I changed the water for the third time and the water is still very dark. Some of the "Duff" has settled on the bottom of the jar and some is still floating on the top.

Sorry, no camera.

[onus]

pflover, I have never heard anything about a purpose for mj roots but to feed the compost pile. I would have to say, though, that given my belief that the good stuff is mostly in the trichomes and only a small percentage in the leafy material, I would tend to discount roots. I grow in pots and would not much look forward to trying to rinse the substrate from the roots. But roots. . . never thought about it. Hmmmm.

Now that winter has set in I have more free time on the weekends, when I tend to attack my projects. And if the projects include heat, such as a pending desire to learn how to make soap, it definitely gets postponed until summer passes, which here in central TX is not until October, believe it or not. I am definitely going to try the light oil extraction for topical administration. I need to keep my feet nice and soft (to prevent cracks, which might be a portal for infection--boy, do they read you the riot act re: your feet when you're diabetic, albeit for good reasons). Aside from some grease spots on the sheets, which my sweet wife would tolerate, seems like this would at the very least be a very good moisturizer, and if it would keep the pain from the neuropathy at bay I'd get to sleep better.

But roots. . . roots. . . they certainly never did Bob Marley any harm. Wait, I think that's another type of Root.

onus

[pflover]

the roots are the only part of the plant that could actually kill you. but they do make a nice topical pain killer. the active substance in them is not a normal cannabinoid. it is not a terpenoid but a alkaliod... cannabisativine and isocannabisativine.

[onus]

pflover:

How does one go about using the roots as a topical anesthetic? Extract the (new to me) alkaloids with something? Are they lipophillic? Or perhaps just mash them up and put in a poultice?

Interesting. And thanks for the info.

onus

[hollowpoint]

onus I use fresh buds ground up to make my budder. I submerge two ounces into simmering water, add a pound of butter, and let it simmer at least an hour.strain off the combo in a cheesecloth and wring the cheesecloth out to get all the goodies. let the bowl cool in the fridge or outdoors then skim off the budder. at this point I reheat it just enough to melt so it can be poured into 1/4 cup containers to make measuring easier for my baking. I then use up to 1/2 cup of budder per 30 cookies. you will get 4-6 hrs of effect from one cookie so they're priceless to me for at night and a good sleep. when you first try a cookie eat about a third and wait at least 2 hours. you really don't want to eat too much at once cause it sucks trust me. "do not ever eat a whole cookie from a new strain of bud or someone else's baking unless you're a hard core med user." you will not have a good time. just treat it like alcohol, you wouldn't drink 50 ounces at one sitting either. or maybe you would lol.

[pflover]

they are water extractable. so far they do not some to stay suspended in lipids implying they are not very lipid soluable in their current chemical state. poultice would probably work ok. i chop or grind them up and then boil for several hours filter and dehidrate the water, then mix it with a lotion usually. can be put in oil, just have to shake the oil very well every use.

[akblugirl]

Onus~
Just a comment about stained sheets....before going to bed, slather your feet with whatever you use (have you ever tried vaseline? works great!), and then put on some nice, thick cotton socks. Not only will they protect your bed linens, but will keep your feet moisturized. The next morning you won't believe the difference!
Hope this helps...
Peace,
AKB

[Roy]

The water cure continues and will be finished tomorrow.

Two things I have noticed that I did not expect.

1. The water is still a brown colour, not as dark as the first couple of days
by still darker than I would have thought given the time the duff has
been in the water.

2. There is about half of the duff sitting on the bottom of the jar and about
half floating on the top of the water. This has been the case for the
last couple of days and I think when the cure is over half will still be
floating. Does anyone know why all of the duff does not sink?

[onus]

akblugirl, that is an excellent suggestion. I never thought of wearing socks after putting lotion on. I remember when I was very young my mother put lotion on her hands and then plastic gloves over them to keep the lotion from drying out. She did that to treat psoriasis, I think.

I think the cotton sock suggestion is excellent. I'll give it a try! I have to admit that when it's cold I sometimes sleep in my socks. So, I'm halfway there!

Thanks again.

onus

[allmanjoy]

as SO points out. ginger, cinimon and black peper increase absorption.

Do you add spices during extraction or do you add spices to baked product?

[pflover]

http://www.treatingyourself.com/vbul...highlight=ghee

i add it to the butter itself once the extraction is over but before it is ready for use. if baking i often add a bit more of the potentiating ingredients to the recipe as well.

[Roy]

Well I finished the water cure of the duff today. The water was still a little brown but for the most part I am happy with the cure. I just took the duff out of my dehydrator and the duff weighs in at 17 grams.

This duff is a combination of bud and small pieces of hash.

I am now going to use a crock pot to melt the duff into some unsalted butter.

How much butter should I use to get a strong product but not one that will knock me off my feet?

[pflover]

I have never weighed my duff.... always done it by loose pack volume. generally i do half a cup of butter to one loose packed cup of duff. this does tend to knock me on my ass so maybe equal volumes of duff and butter?

[allmanjoy]

this does tend to knock me on my ass so maybe equal volumes of duff and butter?

I had 1 oz of duff to 1 cup of butter today but way tooo much water.
But in water it takes bad taste out so no need to do washes. I simmered for 4 hours and will make bananna bread in morning if I can figure out how much butter is a 1/2 cup. I just use to sticks.

My question to you is if you dilute with more butter will you get same knock on your butt by just eating 2 times as much or is it better to have higher concentration in butter and eat less....

My best eating was a hash cookie with black afgan and going to see Frank Zappa in concert. I had full body rushes for about 4 hours... Man I havent seen hash in 20 years.....